k05 vs k07 temperature questions.????

[ZZGIXXER]

the 2005 repsols running about 170 in temp. while running in the freeways...i noticed that the new repsols ..k07 they come with bare frame....clean aluminum frame. at what temperatur are those bikes running??

i have a suzuki gixxer 750.....and it has a bare clean frame....it runs about 155-162 in the freeways even when temperatures are above 75 during sunny days.

i noticed that due to the black paint...heat does not dissipates easier.

any body?????

[Thrasher]

Mines running on average abot 180, and yesterday after a real beating I think it only hit about 190+_1 or 3:eek:

[ZZGIXXER]

Mines running on average abot 180, and yesterday after a real beating I think it only hit about 190+_1 or 3:eek:

you got an 05??

[Thrasher]

07 Bro check out my gallery and Myspace if you have one.

[TX Repsol]

I guess I don't understand how the color of the frame could have any effect on the operating temperature... :confused:

[TX Repsol]

you got an 05??

You can see in his avatar that the frame is bare aluminum, not black. That's the quickest giveaway that it's an '07, not an '05...

[silvercbr]

The frame is not bare, it is painted silver. The swingarm is bare.

[MeanMachine]

I guess I don't understand how the color of the frame could have any effect on the operating temperature... :confused:

It doesn't.

[NEFF]

I had mine at 220 today in stop and go traffic. Once I got moving for a minute or two, it dropped to around 180 which so far for me has been the norm...05' model.

[MEGA]

I had mine at 220 today in stop and go traffic. Once I got moving for a minute or two, it dropped to around 180 which so far for me has been the norm...05' model.

+1 :cool:

[MeanMachine]

I noticed that due to the black paint...heat does not dissipates easier.

Color of the frame has absolutely nothing to do with engine cooling, and the frame is NOT what dissipates the heat, that would be the radiator!

[marccbr]

I had mine at 220 today in stop and go traffic. Once I got moving for a minute or two, it dropped to around 180 which so far for me has been the norm...05' model.

+2 in stop and go always hits 220 till I get going

[Thrasher]

Get rid of the pair air injection crap and the flapper, I just did it and the bike runs and shifts so much smoother, seems to run a little cooler too.

[ZZGIXXER]

I guess I don't understand how the color of the frame could have any effect on the operating temperature... :confused:


it does makes a difference. to my understanding...chrome and cleam frame dissipates heats lot faster than painted black or other color.

im not sure why the bike manufactures went with black frames... in my opinion...i like the clean frames.

[ZZGIXXER]

Color of the frame has absolutely nothing to do with engine cooling, and the frame is NOT what dissipates the heat, that would be the radiator!

you are correct....radiators and coolant helps the engine to cool down. but also for other parts in engine such hoses, plastics, and other parts of the bikes....clean frame, polish, chrome helps reduce the heat on the bike....it is proven.

[MeanMachine]

you are correct....radiators and coolant helps the engine to cool down. but also for other parts in engine such hoses, plastics, and other parts of the bikes....clean frame, polish, chrome helps reduce the heat on the bike....it is proven.

Proven?

OK, post up the data. Lets SEE it.

By the way, the silver frame is NOT a clean frame, its PAINTED silver, just like the black one is painted. NEITHER are clean, BOTH are painted.

Now, about your PROVEN data, I'm waiting.

[Thrasher]

Maybe they should leave the frame bare and put fins all over like a giant heat sink, oh and they could ... Never mind:eek:

[MeanMachine]

Maybe they should leave the frame bare and put fins all over like a giant heat sink, oh and they could ... Never mind:eek:

:D :D Too funny!

[ZZGIXXER]

Proven?

OK, post up the data. Lets SEE it.

By the way, the silver frame is NOT a clean frame, its PAINTED silver, just like the black one is painted. NEITHER are clean, BOTH are painted.

Now, about your PROVEN data, I'm waiting.

you could be wrong or right.....but my bikes that i have had in teh past 10 years all of them suzukis....they have a clear coat not paint...clean aluminum frame to help dissipate heat lot better. and since you are asking for data......i will show it ont the forum. i dont have a scanner to scan the brouchure from my bike.

the bikes from 1996-1998...they came with clean aluminum frame....they were almost copy from the motogp bikes...similar to the one that Kevin schwants used to ride.

[Big Kahuna]

My '98 900RR frame is not painted.

[MeanMachine]

you could be wrong or right.....but my bikes that i have had in teh past 10 years all of them suzukis....they have a clear coat not paint...clean aluminum frame to help dissipate heat lot better. and since you are asking for data......i will show it ont the forum. i dont have a scanner to scan the brouchure from my bike.

the bikes from 1996-1998...they came with clean aluminum frame....they were almost copy from the motogp bikes...similar to the one that Kevin schwants used to ride.

If your data is a brochure from a bike, then that does not count as far as I'm concerned. You said PROVEN. I take that to mean a comparison was done and factual results presented, not a bike specific brochure that makes some kind of proprietary statement. Besides, one opinion in a brochure is FAR from proven.

You said earlier that the coolant and radiator helps cool the bike down. The cooling system merely helps? It actually DOES cool the bike, after all, that IS the purpose of the cooling system. Drain the coolant and run the bike and see how fast you seize the motor.

MANY things assist in cooling where heat transfers from the motor or cooling system and helps it dissipate. Even the transmission will assist in cooling since it draws some heat away from the motor. Thermally the frame is not such an integral part that the color or lack of paint will make a noticable difference in engine temperature. Furthermore, the radiator is isolated from the frame thermally because it is NOT directly in contact with it, it is insulated. In fact, aside from where the motor itself is in contact with the frame, there are no other thermal connections to the frame itself.

As far as the paint issue, Clear Coat IS paint, and a clearcoated frame is not a "clean" frame as you put it.

[ZZGIXXER]

If your data is a brochure from a bike, then that does not count as far as I'm concerned. You said PROVEN. I take that to mean a comparison was done and factual results presented, not a bike specific brochure that makes some kind of proprietary statement. Besides, one opinion in a brochure is FAR from proven.

You said earlier that the coolant and radiator helps cool the bike down. The cooling system merely helps? It actually DOES cool the bike, after all, that IS the purpose of the cooling system. Drain the coolant and run the bike and see how fast you seize the motor.

MANY things assist in cooling where heat transfers from the motor or cooling system and helps it dissipate. Even the transmission will assist in cooling since it draws some heat away from the motor. Thermally the frame is not such an integral part that the color or lack of paint will make a noticable difference in engine temperature. Furthermore, the radiator is isolated from the frame thermally because it is NOT directly in contact with it, it is insulated. In fact, aside from where the motor itself is in contact with the frame, there are no other thermal connections to the frame itself.

As far as the paint issue, Clear Coat IS paint, and a clearcoated frame is not a "clean" frame as you put it.

LIKE I SAID YOU ARE CORRECT...THAT IS THE PURPOSE OF THE RADIATOR TO MAINTAIN THE TEMPERATURE DOWN ON THE ENGINE.

now as far as brochures from dealers and from even the factories stating that clean frame, not painted...in fact helps the bike maintain a lower temperature and helps dissipate heat...than how can you argue with that.....that's too bad i dont have a scanner to scan my books and my brochures to proved you that im talking about is true from the books that i have read and dealer brochures...i dont like to argue but i would like to prove my point with facts.

i have asked my friends if any one have a scanner....still looking.

[MeanMachine]

I would like to prove my point with facts.

I would like you to as well. But as I said, a bike specific brochure is not proof of anything. Show me a test or a study that compares the two situations under the same conditions and offers proof that one actualy runs cooler because the frame of the bike is acting like a giant heat sink. You won't because it doesnt exist.

Next time you ride your bike, and the temp is 190+, touch the frame. If you don't burn your hand then its not doing much at all to help cool the motor now is it? Anything that is truly contributing to the cooling of a hot motor will itself be hot. :rolleyes: Now touch the radiator or even a cooling hose on any hot vehicle and I promise you a nice blistering burn.

[Big Kahuna]

Next time you ride your bike, and the temp is 190+, touch the frame. If you don't burn your hand then its not doing much at all to help cool the motor now is it? Anything that is truly contributing to the cooling of a hot motor will itself be hot. :rolleyes: Now touch the radiator or even a cooling hose on any hot vehicle and I promise you a nice blistering burn.Granted, the Repsol runs pretty darn cool, but my '98 900RR frame gets pretty darn hot to the touch while out riding on or hot summer days. :)

[MeanMachine]

Granted, the Repsol runs pretty darn cool, but my '98 900RR frame gets pretty darn hot to the touch while out riding on or hot summer days. :)

The whole point that started this thread was that the bikes with the black frame ran hotter. This is simply ridiculous, plain and simple. A 2007 repsol with a silver frame does NOT run cooler than a 2007 1000RR with a black frame.

You also CANNOT compare an 07 Repsol and an 05 Repsol since there are differences in the technical specs, compression ratios, horsepower outputs, etc. To compare an 07 with a "silver" frame to an 05 with a "black" frame cannot be done since they are not identical bikes, they will not operate at the exact same temperature and the color of the frame doesnt have anything to do with it, its the differences in the motors.

In short, this entire discussion was merely a colossal waste of time sparked by someones idea that the bikes frame is a heat sink and the color of the paint made a difference in the temperature of the motor.

[The Doctor]

I'm only new here so I don't know any of you...........so here is the unbias opinion of a Mechanical Engineer.........;)

As already stated the engine is cooled by the radiator and air flowing across the engine.

The debate regarding the frame equates as follows:-

The ambient air around an engine will reduce or increase the cooling capabilties of the engine. A dark colored frame will attract more ambient heat than a light colored frame. This means that the rate of heat transfer is reduced when the temperature around the engine is higher.

Think of it like this, if you remove something from your stove and the air temperature is 75 degrees it will take longer to cool than if the the same item was placed in a room that is 55 degree's. The reason being that once the item hits the same temperature as the ambient temperature the rate of heat transfer is dramatically reduced.

There are alot of factors that come into play when considering temperature reduction of an engine, even down to the material the mounting bolts are manufactured from.

Hope this helps.

Borofc

[MeanMachine]

A dark colored frame will attract more ambient heat than a light colored frame. This means that the rate of heat transfer is reduced when the temperature around the engine is higher.


When you say attract more ambient heat, you are referring to sunlight heating the frame. That being the case, a silver 1000RR will attract less ambient heat than a black 1000RR. And since the fairings surround the entire engine and cooling system, the black bike would increase the interior air temperature to a much greater extent than the frame in either case since the frame is skeletal. This would also occur independent of frame color. But then again, in the absence of direct sunlight, frame color and for that matter bike color would not matter. And any effect would be more prevalent on a static bike anyway, not one in motion.

Your theory, while sound from an engineering standpoint (I too am an engineer), would have a very small and for all intents and purposes negligible effect on the operating temperature of a bike, especially when in motion.

In all the years I have been around muscle cars and racing at tracks, the differences in virtually identical cars (dark vs. light) was only apparent in a small way. And the difference with a car would be many times that of a bike, since the body color surrounds the entire engine compartment and would in fact raise the temperature within quite a bit (the same way a dark car is hotter inside than a light car when both sit in the sun).

[TX Repsol]

this entire discussion was merely a colossal waste of time sparked by someones idea that the bikes frame is a heat sink and the color of the paint made a difference in the temperature of the motor.

x10

I think the ONLY time the frame color could even begin to make the SLIGHTEST difference in operating temperature is if a motorcycle were sitting still with the engine running for a long time, negating the effects of the cooling system.

I have to say I agree wholeheartedly with MeanMachine - the small surface area of the frame cannot possibly have enough effect on the air between the frame and the motor to change the operating temperature. And again, that effect would only be seen when the bike is sitting still, since when moving, the bike would get a constant supply of "fresh" air from outside the "engine compartment".

This seems like one of those conversations that neither side will ever agree to the other's... and all the typing in the world won't change the other's mind.

[Big Kahuna]

My head hurts... :p

[The Doctor]

My head hurts... :p

Shouldn't that statement have "Not tonight sweet heart" in front of it.

:D :D :D :D

Borofc